Seems now Pastor Mikey is lecturing atheists on their unbiblical “beliefs’ (actually we have NONE,) and trying to convince us that, oh YES – spiritual apartheid does exist and sheep really are separated from goats and so (putatively) one can exercise such segregation in this life too.
Okay, let’s go through this one more time on the very unlikely assumption (based on near zero probability) that a SUPERNATURAL afterlife exists. (Note here: I distinguish between natural and supernatural afterlife possibilities, since the former was invoked by Sir A.J. Ayer after his near death experience in 1998, and on coming back from that he noted ‘just as there can be a godless life, so also there can likely be a godless afterlife”)
And I then expatiated on this by noting how consciousness could exist in the form of de Broglie waves that would meet that criterion. (To summarize: At death, these de Broglie waves are enfolded into p-wave packets that can escape their associated particles, and act like very finely scaled Electromagnetic waves. The waves also exhibit a similar form to propagating electro-magnetic waves, e.g. E(x, t) = E_o exp [i(kx – wt]) (j) and B(x,t) = B_o exp [i(kx – wt]) (k)) However, the consciousness that results is nonlocal rather than individual or personal- because the expelled waves mix with all other released waves, from all other dead.)
In any case, at least Sir Ayer acknowledged in a London Sunday Times piece published soon after his NDE that his “natural afterlife” was pure conjecture. Not so the extreme zealots and hyper-religionists! They claim the existence of such but as we saw before:
http://brane-space.blogspot.com/2011/01/nihilism-vs-atheism-no-way-same.html
they mess up by committing a number of logical fallacies to make their case. In particular, the afterlife believer’s whole argument rests on the fallacy of Argumentum ad Ignorantium or appeal to ignorance. Thus, the logic proffered by the afterlife believer fails as an argument (in the case of appeal to ignorance) since it requires us to accept the lack of knowledge (about an afterlife) as knowledge, and the lack of evidence as evidence!
One of the most notable illustrations of this nonsensical form of argument was given by Bertrand Russell. He was fond of suggesting that a teapot orbited the Sun just beyond Mars. He said that since no one could disprove his claim, therefore it must be TRUE! In like manner, clueless believers argue since no one has been able to disprove their claims that an afterlife or god exists, these claims must be true!
Following this line of specious reasoning, one would have to accept that the more evidence we lack the greater the likelihood the claim (afterlife or god) is true! This is total bollocks since it's based on the total sum of knowledge not yet acquired! Hence, total ignorance!In addition, it commits the ‘burden of proof’ fallacy which states if one cannot prove ‘X’ (e.g. “There is an afterlife”) to be false, then ‘X’ is true. Thereby, the inability of the atheist to disprove that there is an afterlife becomes the proof of an afterlife.
But this is invalid! The onus of proof (as well as knowledge and evidence) is on the believer, and it is HE who must provide it in the case of either his God or his afterlife, especially his “Hell” phantasmagorias– which as I’ve demonstrated at least six times before- is totally inconsistent with the postulation of an infinite deity since this would presume ONE all-embracing Being leaving no room for ‘Hell’ (unless it is inside or part of GOD!)
Up to now the inept pastor has steadfastly avoided addressing this logical conundrum, but given he’s already flubbed a basic test on logic, I’m not surprised.
Lastly, invoking scriptures or the bible to try to make any case is useless because it commits yet another fallacy: appeal to authority. One can’t base a claim of existence on what some scribe writes in a book, or in a chapter and verse (or hundreds of them) in his KJV.
Anyway, let’s see what Mikey offers in his latest rant:
“It doesn't surprise me that you , as an atheist would say :"The fact is, "salvationism" introduces a false and VERY un-Christian exclusionary isolation and apartheid which Yeshua himself never evinced..."Well , I'd sure like to know what YOUR definition of "Christianity" is . Oh Yeah , I forgot - I DO know . It's letting proverbial spoiled brats like you and your ilk live as you please , and STILL enjoy the ETERNAL bliss of Heaven , RIGHT? Well , sorry 'Charlie,' - if ya don't get right with God before ya die - you may just be neighbors with 'da Popey , our "Catechist" friend , and others like y'all...IN HELL !!”
Here, his meds (or lack of them) seem to have induced total mental confusion. He appears to believe we (atheists) require some kind of benign definition of Christianity in order to assure ourselves (likely based on the specious Pascal’s wager) that if we’re wrong on our unbelief we can still make it to the Pearly gates – failing to grok that it DOESN’T MATTER TO US! (Since we are 99.9999999999999999999999999999999999% sure there is NOTHING after death)
What we are demanding from him is simple evidence for his claims, but he’s unable to give it. All he does is a lot of hand-waving and citing from his defective KJV to try to make a case- and it falls flat because no case is made.
The bottom line here is that the atheist doesn’t assert there’s no afterlife (or that "real Christianity requires no "Hell") because he’s “afraid of death” but because the extremist fundies (like Mikey) haven't provided any significant evidence to counter that proposition! All the evidence shows that when we die, that’s it, finito! Also, by the Ockham's Razor precept (the simplest hypothesis is generally the true one), non-existence after death trumps existence after death (since the latter is more complicated by having to posit special afterlife realms and beings as well, like heaven, hell, demons, angels etc....all way too complex!)
In truth, the atheist isn’t the “spoiled brat’ but the ADULT here! It is Christianoid whiners and infants like this guy who are the spoiled brats because they refuse to be held accountable for their insipid, delusional claims. Because believers haven’t delivered, the atheist is quite justified not to take their claims seriously.
Emotional cripples needing god crutches like Mike, who feel there "must be an afterlife" or life itself has no purpose otherwise, also exhibit a general tendency to resort to another copout that goes by the name, "Sob story". This also includes the claim, by extension, that if life has no purpose and it ends at physical death, then BOO HOO HOO...we could as well off ourselves right now!
Not so! We can act like grownups instead of bawling infants groveling for relief, and create our own authentic purpose! But see, those emotional invalids like the goodly pastor are too needy and mindless to stand up on their own feet - which is why they need to have their god and Bible crutches. Take their precious crutches away and they can't walk two steps on their own, far less THINK one independent thought not already spouted by some deluded scribe in the bible. Thus, only the existentially courageous can conduct their lives and direct and initiate their thoughts, without such crutches.
Worse, he entertains the ideation (based on his defective bible, the KJV) that only HE knows the truth and everyone else that doesn’t measure it the same way (including 900 million Muslims, 950 million Buddhists, 800 million Hindus, and 1 billion Catholics) are all headed for “Hell” and he knows it! And yet he still hasn’t been able to solve the Infinite Deity –Hell conundrum I posited. Thereby showing that minus his minor quotation and copying ability (which a well trained Capuchin monkey could do), he possesses not one minor brain cell capable of resolving a basic logical problem!
There is one word for this: PATHETIC!
Okay, let’s go through this one more time on the very unlikely assumption (based on near zero probability) that a SUPERNATURAL afterlife exists. (Note here: I distinguish between natural and supernatural afterlife possibilities, since the former was invoked by Sir A.J. Ayer after his near death experience in 1998, and on coming back from that he noted ‘just as there can be a godless life, so also there can likely be a godless afterlife”)
And I then expatiated on this by noting how consciousness could exist in the form of de Broglie waves that would meet that criterion. (To summarize: At death, these de Broglie waves are enfolded into p-wave packets that can escape their associated particles, and act like very finely scaled Electromagnetic waves. The waves also exhibit a similar form to propagating electro-magnetic waves, e.g. E(x, t) = E_o exp [i(kx – wt]) (j) and B(x,t) = B_o exp [i(kx – wt]) (k)) However, the consciousness that results is nonlocal rather than individual or personal- because the expelled waves mix with all other released waves, from all other dead.)
In any case, at least Sir Ayer acknowledged in a London Sunday Times piece published soon after his NDE that his “natural afterlife” was pure conjecture. Not so the extreme zealots and hyper-religionists! They claim the existence of such but as we saw before:
http://brane-space.blogspot.com/2011/01/nihilism-vs-atheism-no-way-same.html
they mess up by committing a number of logical fallacies to make their case. In particular, the afterlife believer’s whole argument rests on the fallacy of Argumentum ad Ignorantium or appeal to ignorance. Thus, the logic proffered by the afterlife believer fails as an argument (in the case of appeal to ignorance) since it requires us to accept the lack of knowledge (about an afterlife) as knowledge, and the lack of evidence as evidence!
One of the most notable illustrations of this nonsensical form of argument was given by Bertrand Russell. He was fond of suggesting that a teapot orbited the Sun just beyond Mars. He said that since no one could disprove his claim, therefore it must be TRUE! In like manner, clueless believers argue since no one has been able to disprove their claims that an afterlife or god exists, these claims must be true!
Following this line of specious reasoning, one would have to accept that the more evidence we lack the greater the likelihood the claim (afterlife or god) is true! This is total bollocks since it's based on the total sum of knowledge not yet acquired! Hence, total ignorance!In addition, it commits the ‘burden of proof’ fallacy which states if one cannot prove ‘X’ (e.g. “There is an afterlife”) to be false, then ‘X’ is true. Thereby, the inability of the atheist to disprove that there is an afterlife becomes the proof of an afterlife.
But this is invalid! The onus of proof (as well as knowledge and evidence) is on the believer, and it is HE who must provide it in the case of either his God or his afterlife, especially his “Hell” phantasmagorias– which as I’ve demonstrated at least six times before- is totally inconsistent with the postulation of an infinite deity since this would presume ONE all-embracing Being leaving no room for ‘Hell’ (unless it is inside or part of GOD!)
Up to now the inept pastor has steadfastly avoided addressing this logical conundrum, but given he’s already flubbed a basic test on logic, I’m not surprised.
Lastly, invoking scriptures or the bible to try to make any case is useless because it commits yet another fallacy: appeal to authority. One can’t base a claim of existence on what some scribe writes in a book, or in a chapter and verse (or hundreds of them) in his KJV.
Anyway, let’s see what Mikey offers in his latest rant:
“It doesn't surprise me that you , as an atheist would say :"The fact is, "salvationism" introduces a false and VERY un-Christian exclusionary isolation and apartheid which Yeshua himself never evinced..."Well , I'd sure like to know what YOUR definition of "Christianity" is . Oh Yeah , I forgot - I DO know . It's letting proverbial spoiled brats like you and your ilk live as you please , and STILL enjoy the ETERNAL bliss of Heaven , RIGHT? Well , sorry 'Charlie,' - if ya don't get right with God before ya die - you may just be neighbors with 'da Popey , our "Catechist" friend , and others like y'all...IN HELL !!”
Here, his meds (or lack of them) seem to have induced total mental confusion. He appears to believe we (atheists) require some kind of benign definition of Christianity in order to assure ourselves (likely based on the specious Pascal’s wager) that if we’re wrong on our unbelief we can still make it to the Pearly gates – failing to grok that it DOESN’T MATTER TO US! (Since we are 99.9999999999999999999999999999999999% sure there is NOTHING after death)
What we are demanding from him is simple evidence for his claims, but he’s unable to give it. All he does is a lot of hand-waving and citing from his defective KJV to try to make a case- and it falls flat because no case is made.
The bottom line here is that the atheist doesn’t assert there’s no afterlife (or that "real Christianity requires no "Hell") because he’s “afraid of death” but because the extremist fundies (like Mikey) haven't provided any significant evidence to counter that proposition! All the evidence shows that when we die, that’s it, finito! Also, by the Ockham's Razor precept (the simplest hypothesis is generally the true one), non-existence after death trumps existence after death (since the latter is more complicated by having to posit special afterlife realms and beings as well, like heaven, hell, demons, angels etc....all way too complex!)
In truth, the atheist isn’t the “spoiled brat’ but the ADULT here! It is Christianoid whiners and infants like this guy who are the spoiled brats because they refuse to be held accountable for their insipid, delusional claims. Because believers haven’t delivered, the atheist is quite justified not to take their claims seriously.
Emotional cripples needing god crutches like Mike, who feel there "must be an afterlife" or life itself has no purpose otherwise, also exhibit a general tendency to resort to another copout that goes by the name, "Sob story". This also includes the claim, by extension, that if life has no purpose and it ends at physical death, then BOO HOO HOO...we could as well off ourselves right now!
Not so! We can act like grownups instead of bawling infants groveling for relief, and create our own authentic purpose! But see, those emotional invalids like the goodly pastor are too needy and mindless to stand up on their own feet - which is why they need to have their god and Bible crutches. Take their precious crutches away and they can't walk two steps on their own, far less THINK one independent thought not already spouted by some deluded scribe in the bible. Thus, only the existentially courageous can conduct their lives and direct and initiate their thoughts, without such crutches.
Worse, he entertains the ideation (based on his defective bible, the KJV) that only HE knows the truth and everyone else that doesn’t measure it the same way (including 900 million Muslims, 950 million Buddhists, 800 million Hindus, and 1 billion Catholics) are all headed for “Hell” and he knows it! And yet he still hasn’t been able to solve the Infinite Deity –Hell conundrum I posited. Thereby showing that minus his minor quotation and copying ability (which a well trained Capuchin monkey could do), he possesses not one minor brain cell capable of resolving a basic logical problem!
There is one word for this: PATHETIC!
Sadly, instead of logically and rationally addressing our critiques it is all too likely this pretend pastor will simply hop on his crutches again and bawl as he bangs his widdoo good book, cranking out quote after quote while demanding "there must be a God and He must have a Hell" for infidels like us. Never thinking that emotional tantrums have never substituted for coherent and compelling reasons and arguments, and never will. And calling us "spoiled brats" does not excuse or exempt him from acting like a true spoiled brat in refusing to provide EVIDENCE as opposed to stupid bible citations and more pouting.
1 comment:
ROTFL at the bawling baby who can't get his way! I get a kick how your brother Pastor Mike tosses everyone into Hell! Now, since everyone in the world can't be wrong that means to me that HE has to be the one in error! Good work!
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